please forgive your useless sister.
Joined on 2/27/05
You say you actually haven't watched MGA: 2? And you're writing a post complaining about what it represents...
and you HAVEN'T WATCHED IT?
Ok, well, you should know, love or hate the awesome series, MGA:2 has animation of exceptional quality and originality. It is a wonderfully free and imaginative piece of work.
-Dim
ok i just watched it.
it was bad.
happy?
I can see someone like Egoraptor having a 10 minute show on Adult Swim...a lot of Adult Swim stuff has low quality animation, but it's still fun to watch.
I'm not saying he's ready for TV, but whatever.
Plus, look at the professor brothers. Some of their stuff is hilarious and fun to quote, and they don't even really have animation. It's almost just like a collection of images!
Yes, I prefer animation on your quality, and you're totally right about parodies, but like JohnnyUtah says, his are well made, he performs well, has a good time, and picks out good jokes, not just the overdone and obvious ones.
I fail to see what is 'well made' in the awesome series. they're scribbles.
Your opinions mirror much of my own good sir, the difference being you never let the BS get to you like I have x.x The only reason they do it is it's a kind of scapegoat that's supposed to garentee some kind of success no matter what I guess.
Hell pretty much every multimillion dollar industry now mirrors this with their endless sequels and in the case of cinema no brainer films, it's simply a case of they're soo terrified of not making a profit it makes them scared to take risks... and who better to make money from then the people who don't know any better and would glady have the same recycled stuff over and over? XP
Someday there will be a big turnaround once the audience gets tired of Rocky sequels and talking CGI animals. I think they already are tired of it. But until the industry realizes that recycling content is not a tactic for long-term survival, perhaps they will put the creative people back in charge instead of the men in suits.
They killed Disney, they'll kill the rest of the industry.
wow, you're really cold about this. So you don't think ANYTHING about awesome is good? :/ I liked his art and improved animation in Comp 6 and MGA 2.
I understand, sorry to hear that though.
Barely. Let's face it - most of the awesome series is a bunch of scribbles when you get right down to it. To call the work quality animation is laughable.
But again, this is less about egoraptor's cartoons - i was using him as an example. He's basically the flagship of effortless parody.
Mystic, he doesn't watch ego's stuff. He won't watch it. It's his choice. No point arguing it with him.
way to speak on my behalf. you don't even know me
Well since I'm taking an economic lit class, I guess I'll throw in my two cents. The internet as a market for content has developed so that the content that is most appealing to the majority of the consumers has risen to the top, that may mean parodies, or fads like the clock crew or the awesome videos, or even sprite movies. I understand the ideal, where original content is rewarded and appreciated and monotonous content isn't, but I don't understand how the system can be changed.
The audience will always be for the majority under 16 or something, and appreciative of the parodies and unoriginal content. Any change in what appeals to 13 year olds would have to come from some big change in society... it's a sad state, but even as individuals understanding the problem, we can't really affect the masses. Maybe as the internet grows with the new generations growing with it, the overall audience will change to be looking for more interesting content than sprite movies, that would be dandy, but I don't think it's being ignorant to say "why bother" because it doesn't seem probable that even a large movement of dedicated artists could change what appeals to 13 year olds.
So I think the "problem" is more that the audience is not a random selection of all ages, but mostly immature kids... so of course popular animations like MGA2 wouldn't appeal to people in a random movie theater... but at the same time, of course fast jokes about video games laced with curse words will appeal to the general internet...or ng audience.
And I guess I want to say it's wrong to create "cheap" content like that, but it's animators producing what the audience wants to consume. And so in conclusion of a poorly organized post, I don't think the system is alterable by force...but rather over time we might see it evolve to be more accepting of original content and less rewarding of cheap content.
There's giving the audience what they want, yes.
But I also think there's giving the audience something they didn't know they wanted. Young people are top consumers, but they're also impressionable. I'm not saying they're dumb, I think they just don't have a lot of exposure at that age.
shut up, you're not Gerkinman.
nice job. it shows someone cares for not just authors, but for reviewers. Yes, i do enjoy 'awsome' movies because i for one, am still young, and two, very immature that is brain blasting dazzling with effects and silly humor that anyone could understand. Although, i do not review on my preferences, i review on the preference of multiple people, to make it seem more... encouraging then saying that it wasn't my type and therefore, giving no criticism at all. I will do my best to help those in need, and put down all those who are willing to challenge newgrounds with their pitiful remarks that have yet gotten through the portal.
Sorry if my English is bad... im canadian English side but i can't learn it very well.
oh well. hope you read this. \
~ DEFF
I asked for solutions on how to incite creativity in the masses because I'd really like to rally behind you and your solution. I think it's a sad state of affairs, our consumer world, but I don't know how on earth it would ever be changed. This is why I'm interested in solutions on how to incite creativity in the masses.
people want something, and that something is given. HEY LOOKS WAT AN AWESOM ASS PISS SHIT LOL BLAT BLAT N;GGA YO AWESOM is what people want.
hell, at least the animation was okay, no use of tweens, and it's worth a laugh. not everything is meant to be serious, and entertainment is the thing that less deserves to be serious. come on, the people's average is really low, don't try to change it, no one really cares. grow on your own.
i laughed with it, and i'm the only one of my age that i know that watched the first political debate in spain in the last 15 years. it doesn't mean i'm an idiot, but many people are. well, actually they aren't, they just don't enjoy more "brainy" things
I did not say everything was meant to be serious. A majority of my cartoons aren't even serious to begin with.
As a successful animator, (no I won't disclose my real identity) I myself feel more then a little put out. Newgrounds was named as such for a reason, to be a place where new and original material could be found and published. This is not limited to just the flash and games, but also the audio portal itself. Slowly over time, I have seen the top 50 either stay the same, or be something new from the same author. Egoraptor is one of these such authors, where his skills in voice acting, script writing, and humor are appealing but his animation leave something to be desired. Awesome was all over the flash portal top 50 at one time, still might be today. However, lets not get carried away.
I can almost guarantee that everyone that has been an active member of Newgrounds for at least a week, will know a few authors and gain a biased opinion towards everything else. Mainstream is the core of the problem in more than one way.
Dimrain47, Paragonx9, cornandbeans, Milkman-Dan. Without even describing who they are, I can almost guarantee that you've heard them. The same applies to
rtil, Egoraptor, Krinkels, Adam Phillips, Granfaloon, IllWillPress, Zone-sama, O-Ovinnie and others. You might have spent only one hour on Newgrounds, but I can almost guarantee that you know or at least recognize a few of the people mentioned above.
They are great at what they do, praised for their talent. Some are even pioneers in certain genres and have helped to propel and revive the declining health of Newgrounds at one point or another. But what about the everyone else?
This website contains over 200,000 flash animations, 70,000 games, and over 100,000 audio compositions. How is it that of the thousands of millions of individuals who frequent this website of original submissions daily, ignore the work and time spent in the rest of the submissions? What has happened to the creativity of all of these wonderful people? Where have their own ideas and well-laid out plans gone? The answer is sadly, in the obituary.
When people go to the flash portal for the new submissions, they're not looking at the new submissions. They are simply looking for a title. If it sounds anything like what they were expecting, they give it a 5 regardless as to whether or not it deserved the highest mark available, when in the majority of these cases, it did not. An example of this would be if a new submission had appeared and in its title was the word, Madness. Bam, without even really looking at the animation or game, they would simply open the pop-up, close the box once the scoring chart lights up, and give it a 5.
Don't mistake my words for bitterness at these authors. I respect each one for their contributions and for their creativity. But as I said, I "respect each one for their contributions and for their creativity." They have given Newgrounds their own original material that they actually sat down and thought about, and created. They did not take an existing submission and slightly tweak it, just so that it couldn't be called plagiarizing.
Halomen, inspired from the popular video game Halo and the popular series Tankmen, is original in that it has its own story that does not relate in anyway to its predecessor Tankmen. Some of the techniques are the same, such as animation, and its flow of humor. But the plot was created not copied.
The word Awesome in this community has become synonymous to the word success in that almost anything containing the word in its title is in the top 100. Awesome Creed, though entertaining, cannot be considered original in the fact that it states "If Egoraptor made Awesome Creed".
What if Egoraptor did? The point is that if he did, he would. What the descriptions should truly state is, What if I made Awesome Creed? We have the result as to how that experiment came out. But ask yourself this, what if it wasn't called Awesome? Instead of Awesomefield, why not Danfield or Berryfield? Were you afraid that your submission would immediately receive negatice criticism, be blammed, or receive a horrible beginning score? Is that why you decided to take a "safe" route and use the word Awesome?
Some people have found jobs through this website because of their own talent and ingenuity. Making a parody of a parody can only get you so far. The Ultimate Showdown of Ultimate Destiny was well-received, yet it didn't carry the title of Awesome (sorry Egoraptor, you seem to be the best example for the moment) The Awesome Showdown of Ultimate Destiny. The Ultimate Orgy, was original because of its own style of animation, modification of the existing script to portray a different message, and its overall presentation.
Newgrounds is a place to be discover hidden talent. All I see now are cheap knock-offs that diminish the success of true talent. Take a long hard look at who and what you have favorited. Think about how many other great authors there are, and tell me how many truly qualify to be your favorite. How many of the people and submissions on your list, are actually original?
If after reading all of this, you find that your opinion on the matter has not changed, not even in the slightest. That you find originality uninteresting and not worth even five-seconds of your time. Then I challenge you, to create your own submission. Spend your money, use your time, invest all of your creativity and individuality into making something original. Something that you can honestly sit back after weeks and months of laboring over your computer monitor, and tell yourself that your happy with how things have turned out. Enter your submission into this website, and see if your entry has survived the 200 anonymous votings, not because of your clique (ex. GG, UU, CC, etc.) voting 5. Then tell us how you feel when your reviews tell you to that your submission is "crap", "shit", "is worse then the Kitty Krew", etc.
Would you be happy to know that what took you months, was blammed in twenty-four hours? Would you be happy to know that your own ideas, were not spared a glance? Would you be happy? Would you?
I always thought that Ego's stuff was more of a showcase of his voice talent than his animation. You look at the original awesome stuff (it wasn't even called awesome back then) and its pretty clear that the art was mostly there so that the viewer wasn't merely staring at a blank screen listening to voices. Sure, the animation has come a long way since then but I still think that the voice work is the centerpiece.
I do agree with you and the rest about artists pandering to the average viewers tastes, thats bad. I think though that you have to consider the possibility that the artists just like the subject matter themselves. Back in our early days, I certainly never once thought 'hey, lets make a cartoon about games so that we can be popular', the thinking was more along the lines of 'hey, I really like games, and I'm learning this cool new skill, I'd really like to make a cartoon about the games I love'.
Since then of course, I've moved onto coding, so you'd have to ask Dim about the motivations behind our movies these days :)
Tom-
I don't think his voice work is that great either (good mic =/= good voice actor), but anyway, there's no harm in someone getting into the flash world by starting with parody. I did it myself. But people continue doing it for the wrong reasons once they are exposed to the results.
So you see my point, that what is popular is what the majority of the users like, and I agree that most of the users haven't been exposed, or haven't matured to the point where they would enjoy original content more than sprites or parodies or clock crew movies. Unfortunately "giving the audience something they didn't know they wanted" isn't a real thing...I wish it were, it's not a 13 year old sees something and says oh wow I suddenly like this because it's original content. What I'm saying is the system is the system, and if the general population of users, or "consumers" grow in their experiences to be people who appreciate original content more than parodies and what not, I think that's the only way we will see massive change, just as time progresses and young generations mature.
I'm also with afro ninja on the artists will create whatever artist enjoy to create, and while audience is of course a factor, it's a minimum factor imo. So it's not really doing anything to say hey make original content not parodies and shit, because people will make what they want to make...
The clock crew is not a beloved fad, morons. At least it's not supposed to be. In the early days it was hated and it maybe less now but not really by much. I should fucking know. Bad or good, It varies greatly in quality, creativity, skill and purpose because it's made up of a ton of different members you nazis! It's not their fault you have the tenacity to judge everything the same by the name of the author or their association. That's part of the problem.
I know this has nothing to do this blog but it was brought up here for some reason. I am guessing so people can make sense of what RTL is talking about by equating something they don't like with what the subject matter is even though I know he agrees with them.
this is the most meaningful post I have seen ever. the time of good genuine animation is whitiling away to stupid cartoons. even TV cartoons are dying, now they fart out crappy ideas like kung foo chickens or somthing or rather, it makes me sick how I can't sit down every saterday morning and watch something that was actually put effort into.
When M.G.A. came out I loved the satiracle value, but things have gone way over bord. It's sad that Newgrounds has become what it has. Instead of a place where you could see original work by original artists you get the clone shit that's already everywhere else. But still it get's submited and we say "OMG ROFLMAO MAEK MOR!!1" andthat's all we get. It's not just "Awesome" it's everything. If Tom was dead he'd be rolling in his grave.
And lets face it, they need all the help they can get to make sense of this blog because most of the people here seriously don't understand and they probably never will.
Ha.... now it seems like everybody is following in your tracks. At least with a couple of blog posts made after this.
As far as your post goes though.. no comment really :/
my haters are my biggest fans
image macro goes here
I'm just not indy enough to get this.....
Stormast
I wouldn't totally agree with that.
I've often been checking off what trend there was on Newgrounds for years - in fact, the first time I saw this site was when I travelled to the US...In 2000 I think, or something like that.
Yeah, there are things you dislike. But I do hope that, thanks to the diversity in submissions to Newgrounds, you'll eventually find some movies or games you like.
Yeah, Newgrounds is run by its users - and sometimes by the team, too :P -, and that leads to something every one knows : the crowd effect will always be more important here than the "objective" quality of a flash.
But in the mean time, what determines the quality of a submission...Is it only about judging it artistically ? I mean, the fact that you personnally don't find it funny doesn't mean every one should hate it...And the fact that some of those who like Egoraptor's flashs are retards doesn't mean anyone who likes MGA2 HAS TO BE a retard.
I'm quite older than 13, and I still find it funny. I wouldn't say it was the best flash ever, I wouldn't even say it really puts any flash to shame, still it was funny.
And that's a good point. A "good flash", to me, may be good for a certain number of reasons :
- It may be artistically perfect ( or nearly :P ).
- It may be really funny.
- It may be original.
- It may have a good script.
Etc...
Yeah, there are Awesome T-Shirts. Well there are some Tankmen T-Shirts too. I don't think it's a crime having a larger choice over some typical NG flashes. Whether you like them or not is only your problem...