i agree alot with you. i did enjoy the awesome series, but i can say it's pretty disappointing when something like your Freetown - Metropolis Circuit (which is damn amazing, by the way) is shunned down to something as uncreative as the awesome series.
I understand where you're coming from.
please forgive your useless sister.
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[LARGE CONTROVERSIAL COMMENT GOES HERE]
So I read many of the comments. And I agree and disagree with many parts of what's been said.
I realize that I "officially" joined Newgrounds quite recently, and that when I did see what was on Newgrounds in years past, that they were just glimpses of the "culture" and the "eras."
I also do not know an awful much about the Awesome series; however, if I remember correctly, did Egoraptor not mention that he was trying to get better? Or on the road to 'better animations'?
If I also remember correctly, you were talking about animators and trying to get better?
If anything else, a flash animation can be judged for more than the drawings. There is some artwork out there that looks quite simple, and many people feel it is not art, as even they can draw it. At the same time, from another point of view [at least] that artwork has a "deeper meaning" to it, and no one thought to use that medium or that message and put them together in such a way.
Sure, things are overdone, and perhaps there is no depth or meaning to certain flashes, and that they are made just for the currently known "best" or "most popular" way of getting out there, entertaining the masses, and getting good reviews.
I agree and disagree, however, with the concept, or perhaps fact that many or most flashes are declining animation due to their only purpose being to attract the masses with the least amount of effort possible.
It's possible it is different in a certain way - inspiring others to be more creative, or to perhaps make a good flash even with bad animation (although the latter phrase detracts from the original post).
It's possible that the style was intentional (in this case, e.g. a parody of a parody, or parodying the current fad, if anything else).
Is it not possible that, as another user said before me, that all the "crap" can exemplify and further emphasize and point towards better animation?
At the same time, "Everything, by Everyone" gives more and more ideas, more and more exposure of different styles, etc.
Someone also said before me, that things have slowly been getting better and better.
Sure, things could be -even- better, and people should and could be more aware, like many things in the world. Thus I agree with what I feel is the overlaying message in this post - that people could be more aware of more, even better things, and that it is sad to see that much of animation is just following a formula for quick success and profit (which is debatable, of course) - that people are missing out so much due to the masses pointing to a fad that was directed to the status quo of [they are entertained by this, let's make this style of entertainment] and [we find this entertaining, only more of this will be entertaining to me].
However, isn't it possible that people can like both things, as can be seen in the users before me. Perhaps more users, though unaware until your post, have liked more than just the "this is the entertaining fad of the moment" as they liked both mediums and styles.
As I need to go do something real quick, and certain things disrupted my current train of though, I'll leave for now with a concluding statement of...
Look at the bright side? Things are getting better it seems, and posts such as these bring a good and a bad atmosphere. Good in a sense of working towards improvement and awareness of the status quo and a possible and potential slip on a hill, and bad in a sense that it has a negative feel at some points which do tend to seem to lean towards some bitterness. At the same time, thank you for the post - as it was thought provoking, post provoking, and, as it seems, feeling invoking as well.
I hope things get better and as they do, you can and feel things getting better as well, as it seems there is much focus on the negative aspects, which can be good to spread awareness, but perhaps not the best in terms of overall progress.
Welps, I'll be back. xD I hope I got some thoughts across coherently in an interesting fashion so that I'm not just kicking an old topic or being too controversial. Just want to try and see my own point of view, and share that with others to see brighter sides on broader horizons.
~Dayne
with the amount of suck on this website, Egoraptor is the least of your worries. At least he entertains and works harder on his stuff than a loooot of people that get their shit on here.
Okay, I've been going to newgrounds for about 3-4 years now, but I've never had an account here. However, reading your post, RTIL, drove me to actually sign up with the site so I could post.
Anyways, I wanted to say that I whole-heartedly agree with you on your views and observations. I feel as though the majority of animations on newgrounds are shallow and of poor quality, and yet, they receive an abundance of recognition.
You're animation "Flash Comedy Extravaganza" couldn't have explained the situation better. I abhor how originality is left in the dark and unnoticed, while pointless parodies with recycled jokes get all the attention. I find myself frequently x-ing out of animations as soon as a familiar and overly-popular video game character is used, because unless I've seen something new before that happens, then I know that the animation is just going to be a repeat of all the other parodies that flood this site.
I will admit that I used to be a big fan of parodies, but as I continued visiting the site, my tastes and preferences changed. I started to want to see original and experimental animations, and so I stopped clicking on links to parodies or links with familiar titles, and instead took risks to discovering new talents and styles.
I strive more on original content now that I have matured, and I moved these views from animation, to other things as well, like movies, television, radio, comedy, etc. I find it very sad how stale entertainment has become, and I constantly imagine what it would be like if everyone decided to stop catering to people who just want the same thing over and over again, and give them something new.
Can you imagine a world where all entertainment tried to be original? No more recycled jokes, no more familiar characters, no more random nonsense... If everything strived to be unique, most people would change the way they see things. Most people would start looking at problems from abstract angles and find creative solutions to any type of qualm. We would live in a world that would stimulate creativity, and I would love to be in a place as colorful as that.
I really wish that one day a large group of people will all decide to stop catering to what people already want, but rather, try and show them other things they might like. I encourage all artists of animation to not give up on your original content. If you are worried that nobody will give it a second look, at least know that I will always be willing to give it a try, and I do indeed thrive on your ideas in hopes that they may inspire me as well.
At this point I just want to say that I did enjoy MGA2, and I do enjoy some other parodies. My reasons for this are mostly due to nostalgia, as well as the fact that my childish side does enjoy to be tickled every once and a while. However, flashes such as those will never earn as much respect from me as do those who try to be different, do.
I'm fascinated that you have been going here for so long and my news post was what got you to sign up. Well your story is pretty much what happened to me, when I found this site in 2005 all I saw were Legendary Frog and parodies galore. I watched them and had to convince myself this was the 'cream of the crop' - everyone seemed to be saying so, but I couldn't believe it. Then I was introduced to the Star Syndicate, and they're actually what got me to realize this was all a bunch of lies, and the real good stuff was hiding underneath all the featured links and award-ridden content.
I do hope that someday people start turning en-masse to their original ideas, and have more confidence they will succeed in using them. It would be so great for this community, and could carry on far past Newgrounds.
I totally fill every word you said. When I was browsing NG back at the day,and went to "PSP download" section which had MGA1. I haven't seen it,but though "this must be something great",but I was disappointed. Honestly I thought,and kinda right now still think it sucks.
But on the other hand,I DO enjoy other "awesome" movies. Yes,they suck with graphics. I think somebody mentioned this - "Ego is more into showing off his voice skills,than animation(though I must admit MGA2 did show some skills,with FBF animation and shit). No one ever remembers MGA as "the graphics rock!!!1!!" but more in like quoting some lines from it.I believe go mentioned that he wants to Voice acting as a living.
I totally know why you snapped,I'd do the same thing,when you spend your time and all to create a masterpiece like "Metropolis Circuit" and get blown away with a half-ass rushed in a 1 day video game parody (or even worse,some hentai gallery).
I totally agree with every point you mentioned,but I guess the only thing you (we) can do is....try our best!
-oh,and don't be mad at Ego 'cause he's having fun,I'm sure he didn't mean to insult animation culture or anything :)
peace
it's not about me vs egoraptor. it's about the direction the animation community is headed in.
Im not sure if I agree with you or not...
Whilst I do appreciate a good, well animated, creative and original cartoon, people also enjoy the humorous aspect of things. In my opinion, I will prefer somthing funny rather than somthing deep or meaningful, not to say that i would completley disregard the latter, but its a lot easier to say to someone "Hey, have you seen MGA2 yet? What about the bit where...." and have a laugh with a friend, rather than saying somthing allong the lines of "Hey did you see Waterlollies yet? Dont you think the use of camera in..." to the same person, Unless that person understands the qualities of animation themselves.
I think the way things works is that an animator will appreciate a good work of art, but the majority of people that go onto this site are not animators, the majority are people who probably searched "Funny cartoons" or "Games" into google. They're here to have a laugh, not to appreciate the finer works of art amongst the community.
However, I dont think your should penalise ER for making a popular movie. To be honest, I dont really find the awesome "collections" funny, just MGA and MGA 2 but its what works for him. He's happy, the vast majority of it's veiwers are happy.
i agree with almost everything you said however, metal gear awsome 2 in particlar has preety good aniamtion, when his charcaters talk they dont just stand their they have a personalty.
however the current score that metal gear awsome 2 has is well...
retarded it has a score of 4.70 and is not going down.
Egoraptor is hilarious, I see nothing wrong with his flash. The real problem is garbage like "Gamer Kids" (just as an example), with hideous artwork and terrible joke(s). Basically its the fact that everything in the genre of video game parody is getting lots of attention, good or bad. I see nothing wrong with a good video game parody getting a good score, just as a good flash of any other genre gets a good score for being entertaining.
Another example of really good video game parodies is the Decline Series. I would be appalled if Decline was rated poorly. Just as appalled as I get when I see how high some of the really bad parodies score.
what's funny and what isn't funny is a matter of taste - but hilarious or not, i don't care what anyone says - it is EASY to write jokes for video games. all you're doing is observing curious things about the universe of the game, which is what happens when you sit there and play it.
it's also safe to say the decline series is rather dated, now.
I admit most animations here in NG are parodys of games or simply boobs, but people like em >.> i like parodies myself, i started in the world of animation not long ago and my first works are going to be madness combat / VG parodies, not for fame just for the fact that its a good way to increase my skill and make some good old crude humor, i do plan later on work on my original story not really for the fame but for the fact that i will see my very own totally idea animated.
Parodies and the other uve mentioned are part of newgrounds, but the good animations like ur project freetown, braken wood, castle3, original madness, valhalla knights, joe zombie and way others i dont remember right now are an important part of NG without em i dont think id be here.
I enjoy both ways of animations they all have their side, the parodies are done in a faster rate and can help ur mood in a bad day or just to make urself feel better, the seriously worked ones are to be amazed and be way more thougtful about it, like y did this character do this or woah thats a deep story... both have their thing that make em an important factor to NG i enjoy em both and i plan to make animation on both sides
And as for 3D animation... yes they are killing the good old 2D like those poor animators take ages working on em just to do a crappy story with a good looking all fluffy character... i would like the 2D-3D balance to come back
back in 2000 or before there werent that many 3D movies, there was actually a balance, some 3D some 2D now this is too much... only place i can see good old 2D is here in NG
Wow i wrote a larger coment than i was planing XP well in sumarry i like both style of NG animations and 3D has gotten over rated
-Erreip 199
i respect parody for what it is - a lot of my cartoons ARE parodies - but i think the genre is mostly abused, and it is too bad.
the reason 3d is dominating is only because it is cheaper for companies to ship overseas. that is all the industry cares about now - money. maybe that is all they ever did care about, but at least they were efficient and smart about it in the 60's.
I know. It makes us animators feel like we are wasting our time, doesnt it? specially you, who makes visually impressive good flashes.
and about the boob icon. yeah you are right when the swain changed the icon of mastermind it was returned back to frontpage. is it fair? no.
(no offense cos I like the swain. his animations are stylish too).
tom did that for him.
last bust not least. you are not the only one here. you have no idea how many authors have written anti-awesome propaganda. I have seen negative posts by tomorrows nobody, the flash bros. sekey space lizzard. and about 20 other great guys.
What will be the outcome of this flash war. will everyone leave newgrounds hand hate it? practically leave egoraptor have his way with this site? i dont know.
Egoraptor is funny but he is just abusing of easy users.
tomorrow's nobodies were whining about me. the rest were just parodies of all the drama in here. but it is clear from the comments that there are people who agree with me.
THIS IS THE PEOPLES FAOULT FOR MAKING SO MUCH EGORAPTOR PROPAGANDA
ALL THESE GUYS HATE EGO
gerkinman, flash bros. tomorrows nobody, pigpen, sekeyspaceylizard, Rtil, sirpongo.
eh, i don't HATE the guy, i do however disagree with everything he's ever done and created. also, you have to realize this isn't only about egoraptor. he's simply a perfect example to argue my cause.
Ego should be thanking you for making him a tad bit more famous. I'm kinda disappointed that you will not tolerate people making flashes just for fun. They HAVE to be top notch? He didn't choose for them to be famous. He was surprised the that MGA was even accepted at all, ya know?
I was just talking to my friend and showed him your greatness on Metropolis Circuit.
He said it was a little funny that you were hating on parodies when apparently Metropolis Circuit looks like a spitting image of a game called "Jet grind Radio." He said the characters, the city, the movements/gameplay, everything was almost exactly the same. Being inspired is one thing, but he said it was just like it. I don't know for sure, my friend's the one who knew the game, I'm not attacking you...I just thought I'd put that point out there.
People draw comparisons by nature. Freetown is not inspired by a video game. The only similarities are that it takes place in a city (wow) and the two characters are rollerskating. There aren't rollerskates in any of the rest of the series.
If I wanted to make something like Jet Set Radio, there would be teenagers running around tagging things and beating up cops.
also - ego was PAID to make the awesome compilations. he submitted them here, once per month. I wonder why.
Metal Gear Awesome is the "Epic Movie" of Flash animation
Poeple spend too much time argueing about the future of NG, the direction the 2D animation community is going, and other crap.
I think everyone should just chill out, relax, and learn from eachother. Learnin' neat tricks from a friend is easy, but from an enemy it is a challage and tough challages are usually rewarded greatly. ^^
I'm not sayin' go make some stupid 'lil game parody. I'm just sayin' that in the most controversal flashes... their's always something you can learn from. Wheither it's a trick, style, good thing, bad thing, there is always somethin'. :)
Well it's pretty simple I say- It's humor vs art!
You got the artist who try their best to do something really nice and serious but isn't always acclaimed by everyone because, after all, art is much more complex than humour
Then you have humor, a simple yet amazing thing that everyone can enjoy and feel nice when listening to it!
To choose humor or art is your choice and you can change anytime, but if someone is making a funny flash with rather poor animation skills, well, it's still good, because the jokes don't need pictures and/or images to understand them.
Look, im simply saying that if you're scared about that the artist dies and leave place to humor, so be it, I mean, who are we to tell people what to do and not to do, we live in a free net. Like, would you love that people start saying that great animations are ruining newgrounds b cause the're not funny at all and newgrounds is now a place for fancypants artist and not for more normal people anymore?
Anyway, think about it!
-sincerely yours
hunter-lurker
are you suggesting humor and art can't coexist?
So...what's wrong with that? I totally understand what you mean, but at the same time if he submitted them all together, they'd get ignored. I just can't see him doing it just for more money. I doubt he's so cocky where he assumes he'll get monthly every month. He wants his stuff seen, I would too. If he get money, cool, but if not, it probably doesn't bug him. That's not the ultimate goal in entertainment.
Well, idk, I'm just saying what I would do. I might submit some things for fun, to be funny, to play with flash and have a good time. I know for a fact I can't do what you can, but that doesn't mean I can't try to entertain the rest of the newgrounds community, does it? I don't care about money, I just want to entertain. Would there be anything wrong with all that? I'm not going to submit 1 drawing that I tween around the screen, but at the same time I can't rock FBF quite as well as you elite flashers.
FleshSiren
I suppose there's no arguing about that..... Well put, I'm afraid. *sigh* well, at least I enjoyed a few of them.